u/Knikkey wrote (the comment Michael replied to):
Not OP, but what do you think about Formation instead of a boot camp? I don’t have a CS degree like OP, as I’m a self-taught (hopeful) career changer, but like OP, I’ve been struggling to get my foot in the door. I’m feeling like Formation might be better than a boot camp since F
u/michaelnovati replied · ★ FEATURED
Hi, Formation isn't a good replacement for a bootcamp for most people. There have been a very small number of people that have done this but the reasons have to be right and we usually reject people without some kind of relevant experience. For example, self taught but contributions to large open source projects might be a good fit.
I don't recommend doing it in this market because almost all of these cases were people who got top tier entry level roles and sometimes from new grad headcount, and the market has tanked for entry level and new grad roles. The same struggles apply with going to a bootcamp, but I'm not also not advising doing Formstion right now in this bucket, UNLESS you have a job already and are doing it part time over a long period of time.
Second giant note: ISAs are great for the reasons you mentioned. But if you end up being one of the minority percentage that give up, you still have to pay a prorated fee based on the time of your training (it's still conditional on being employed, but could be any job). If you fully understand that, great, but nothing is too good to be true.
Some other points though for the record as many people might read this over time and things change:
- We don't really "teach" anything and aren't a school. What this means is that we don't have lectures or classes where we go over a list of topics following a plan or specific teaching style. 1-1 mock interviews are conducted like real interviews, but small group sessions are all interactive problem solving sessions led by a mentor, who is guiding the group towards solving a specific problem, or set of problems around a skill. So the experience varies by mentor and by who the peers are. The goal is that you are exercising a muscle and the mentor is a personal training helping you exercise properly.
- People with no experience have gotten pretty good jobs. Not all, just like any program, some people give up in the job hunt, or leave early, or change their goals. But most people get good jobs, and they generally take longer doing it. So the time spent at Formation and job hunting might be the same or longer than going to a bootcamp, but you won't be doing 12 hour days and will hopefully get a better first job to set up your career well.
- Some backgrounds it has worked well for:
-- Warehouse worker, contributed to open source for about 2 years and did Formation, got entry level job at Atlassian after about a year
-- Ivy league math grad working in VC, did Formation, got new grad role at a top tier company
-- Self taught DS&A and was coin flipping between doing Codesmith and Formation, did Formation and got an entry level job at a top tier highly desired startup.
- A very very very important note, because most people in this bucket repeatedly ask for this, is that we don't help create a portfolio and you don't do any notable projects at Formation. You do some practical work but it's all targeting interview skills and making you a better engineer. It's the exact opposite of a bootcamp where you hardly learn any skills because it is so fast and programs are focused on making your resume look flush with projects and experience.
Happy to answer more questions.